Junior Member
GE 474/476 logix system - Charger
Looking for a reasonable water softener system - living in tampa, fl. I came across someone who was selling GE water softener system - 474/476 Logix system . I couldn't find it online. Looks like the guy is selling this as a dealer of Charger Water Treatment products. offer price was 1000 installed.
Price seems very reasonable as compared to rainsoft or kinectico who charge insane amount.
Any experience with this system?
Senior Member
I've never heard of an Autotrol 474 control valve but I don't keep up on Autotrol as I used to. IMO Autotrol control valves are not as good a choice as the Clack WS-1CS, or Fleck, control valves.
Gary Slusser
22 yrs in water treatment and well pumps, 13 yrs helping people on the 'net to help themselves.
Moderator
Try this linkOriginally Posted by filterforum
http://hilehaus.com/Charger%20Docs/P...X%20SERIES.PDF
Junior Member
So how does this system compare to the likes of one available in local hardware stores? am i getting more value as they are charging twice the money.
The brochure attached in the thread and the one provided by local installer doesn't provide any details about what the system will remove from my water.
Once again thanks to everyone providing feedback to help me make an informed decision.
Moderator
I don't know what is offered at local stores. A softener removes hardness minerals, primarliy calcium carbonate and ferrous iron. Some manganese can also be removed. When you buy from alocal professioanl, you get follow up service, a person that knows what they are talking about, spare parts, etc. When you buy from a store, you save some up front but they are usually the bottom rung of equipment.
I didn't notice any test results from you. What do you have in your water?
Andy
Senior Member
What is at the link is what Charger calls it, I do not believe Autotrol has a 474 valve. I know they sell a proprietary version of the Clack WS-1, so maybe that is a proprietary Autotrol Logix timer on a non published version of a 255 or 263 control valve body like the 269 valve and 463i timer.
If so parts would have to be purchased from one of their dealers.
I see they use smaller than normally used and odd sized tanks.
The nonproprietary version can be bought on line for several hundreds less than $1000, and you can install it yourself in a couple hours or hire a plumber or handyman to do it and still save maybe $200 to $300.
Then you can buy parts from any online or local dealer selling Autotrol control valves.
A much better choice would be the Clack WS-1 on a correctly sized softener with an industry standard sized tank.
Gary Slusser
22 yrs in water treatment and well pumps, 13 yrs helping people on the 'net to help themselves.
Senior Member
I have no clue what your water conditions are and you really need to know before you can make an informed decision but, assuming it's hardness and a bit of iron you can pick up a Fleck 5600 online from around 500 to 800 dollars depending on size requirements. The Fleck 5600 is an industry standard. A solid and reliable valve and timer assembly that will give you many years or reliable service. For a couple hundred more you can get a metered demand head which is nice because they will perform the required functions dependent on water usage. Of course this is assuming that you wish to tackle the installation of the unit yourself. If not you should find a local, reputable plumber or filter contractor and ask questions.
Senior Member
Anyone can buy a metered Clack WS-1CS between those prices too. And it is a much better control valve in all ways than the 5600 in any of its versions.
Anyone with the desire to install their own softener can do so in about 2-2.5 hrs and they probably don't have to solder anything, so they don't need to hire an expensive plumber.
Gary Slusser
22 yrs in water treatment and well pumps, 13 yrs helping people on the 'net to help themselves.
Senior Member
Well, maybe some can do it in a couple hrs, but not everyone has the tools, skill or knowledge to cut into copper piping, install a properly vented trap for the drain, run the electrical circuit and install the equipment to code. Yes the clack is a nice unit. I sell a lot of them, I personally prefer them to the Fleck but, I can buy the Fleck for less than the Clack WS-1 and I can sell it for a couple hundred less also. Been using flecks for more years now than I can remember and have always had very very good service with the unit. Cost for some folks is an issue and even 50 bucks can make a difference in some folks budgets. Either way, fleck or Clack, the homeowner is going to get a reliable piece of proven equipment.
Senior Member
Yeah that's why I said anyone with the desire can do it, which can include buying a few common tools most homeowners should have around their home anyway.
Come on man, I know you're against online line sales and DIYers but you're supposed to be a MASTER plumber of like 50 years, and a high schrool plumbing teacher... You really can't think it takes a lot of SKILL to use a tubing cutter... LOL
It's no different than using a can opener except the cutter goes around on the tubing instead of the tubing rotating.... As you know, it usually takes like 30-45 seconds - 3-4 times around and it's done.
Gary Slusser
22 yrs in water treatment and well pumps, 13 yrs helping people on the 'net to help themselves.
Senior Member
Wow, I have a desire to sing....what do you think?? Can I???
Sure, I can try, it would be just a little counterproductive.
Senior Member
Yep, most homeowners have a torch in their tool box along with solder, flux a couple different pipe cutters, pipe wrenches ect.
For me, it is indeed second nature. for someone that has zero experience it could well be a daunting task. Either way though there are codes that must be followed and the installer should have some working knowledge of water supply and distribution piping as well as DWV piping and codes that apply. I know that you think all codes are some sort of government conspiracy to bamboozle folks out of money but as long as there are codes and inspectors that enforce codes your opinion is of little concern to anyone other than yourself. Not having a license is not an excuse to break the law.
That aside, what do your posts have to do with the OP question? I believe I gave him some useful advice. What did you contribute? BTW, could care less what you sell. I understand fully that that is how you make a living and that's fine. The only time I have ever got on your case about it is on the many forums that specifically forbid selling on their site and the strong arm tactics that you constantly use to try and force others with dissenting opinions off the site. You need to get back on the Prozak or start wearing the tin foil helmet.
Last edited by NH Master; 12-27-2009 at 11:17 PM.
Senior Member
That all sounds so... a... official. And 'I'm better than you' professional, and as always, anti-DIYer.
Gary Slusser
22 yrs in water treatment and well pumps, 13 yrs helping people on the 'net to help themselves.
Senior Member
Your just trying to make a buck. Sad.
Senior Member
Exactly what part of anything I posted is anti DIY? or "I'm better than you"?
If this is the best you can do, maybe it's time to think about sewing your name tag in the back of your sweaters and checking into the local home for the aged.
Moderator
I wasn't getting the impression you were conveying THAT message at all. In fact I have seen where you have posted supporting those who wanted to do things themselves. Not sure where Gary got that impression.
Senior Member
He gets it from a post I started on another forum, in the "professionals only" area (where since he ain't licensed, he should not even be) that in a nut shell said that a good lot of the advice given by professionals was hurting the trade. He took it to heart because his entire living is based on selling to diy'ers online. For the hundredth time though, " I have nothing against online sales " If I had the time, I would probably set up some sort of online store myself. What I have always objected to is selling online on forums that prohibit it or sneaking around the back way and PM'ing every poster to get them on your sales site. I also object to unlicensed people giving out dangerous advice or advice that circumvents plumbing codes. I try very hard not to give folks advice that could get them in trouble, or advice that might lead them to believe they are capable of doing something that they are not. DIY is not going away. Pretty much every homeowner that ever fixed a door knob or replaced a faucet washer is a DIY'er. I am a DIY'er. I don't pay tradesmen to do jobs I can do myself unless I don't have the time or desire to do so. (house painting comes to mind) But, plumbing and electrical are trades that require a good bit of training, understanding and skill. There are state and local codes in place to insure the health and safety of not only the homeowner but the entire neighborhood and beyond. Those codes are in place to keep folks from doing stupid things that may endanger everyone's well being. Modern sanitary plumbing practices are the number one reason why people rarely die from cholera, diphtheria and a host of other maladies that regularly killed thousands in the past.
Last edited by NH Master; 12-28-2009 at 07:58 PM.
Moderator
The behavior of a professional often relfects in their words as well as their actions.
Senior Member
You bet!!! Why would anyone buy from Gary?? All I know about him is he likes to dispute everything.
Trying to help people NOT get cheated ON THE NET.
Senior Member
I just love how you want to run forums you don't own but don't bother to put one up yourself where you can run it any way you want to but whine because forum owners won't cater to your whims.
I have never PMed anyone anywhere, especially to get them to go to my site or sell them anything. I DON'T HAVE TO, every forum has a Profile and members can access it and click a link to my site.
I can tell you that if you tried to sell online, you probably would fail very quickly.
Let me ask you what business is it of yours if someone buys something from me because of my posts on forums? Why are you so much against that? IMO it is because you want to stop ME as revenge for my disagreeing with you about whatever, like in the Pros thread you mention above. Better people than you have attempted that and my volume of business increases, so thanks for the help you provide me.
BTW, as I've told you a hundred times by now, I do not have to have a license, there is no license I could get if I wanted one! Yet you go on about me not being licensed! I guess you don't know how that makes you look but others see it as dumb; or you being stuck on stupid.
Gary Slusser
22 yrs in water treatment and well pumps, 13 yrs helping people on the 'net to help themselves.
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